Highlights From The Comments On "Sorry You Feel That Way"

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[Original post here.]

Aeon writes:

The main complaint about this expression is that it’s “not a real apology,” and that’s true, it isn’t. The error is in thinking it is therefore a fake apology. But it isn’t, because “I’m sorry” is not a statement of contrition, it’s a statement of sorrow. Somehow everyone has gotten confused into thinking an apology is the only correct use for that phrase despite the plain meaning of the words.

This is the comment that best expresses what I wished I’d said at the beginning.

The original meaning of “sorry” is “sad” (eg “in a sorry state”). This meaning is preserved in phrases like “I’m sorry to hear your relative died”.

This turned out to be a good phrasing for apologies - “I’m sad that I stepped on your foot” implies “I apologize for stepping on your foot” - so eventually it became common to use “sorry” this way too.

Some people, when you say you’re sorry their relative died, answer “Why? It’s not your fault.” You could argue that you should have to think up some entirely new phrasing to express sympathy at relative-death in order to appease these people. But it’s hard to think up new phrases. “Condolences” makes you sound like a psychopath. “I’m sad your relative died” sounds bizarre and childlike. At some point, you need to just accept that “sorry” is our language’s default word for this. If somebody thinks it’s funny to deliberately annoy you with pretend incomprehension at a funeral, you have my permission to respond with “Actually, I’m glad your relative died, and I hope you’re next.”

Maybe we should all be linguistic descriptivists, and if enough people think “sorry” can only mean “I apologize for something and admit it was my fault”, we should abandon it to those people. I think this is probably true in the long run - but if you make it too easy, they’ll just take the next useful word and do the same thing with it. So we should at least raise a little bit of protest on the way out.

Cvantez writes:

I feel like I've used the phrase "I'm sorry" my whole life to express sorrow but not contrition, e.g. "I'm sorry to hear your aunt is in the hospital". But only in the past few years have I started hearing a response: "it's not your fault". Which, like, of course it's not my fault. I didn't intend that meaning of the phrase.

Either I've begun spending time with people who have a random quirk of communication, my memory is faulty and I've always gotten this response, or there's been some shift over time in what apologies are supposed to mean.

I wonder if this is just a generational gap, and the sympathy meaning seems obvious to all older people and incomprehensible to younger people.

Imaginary-Tap-3361 writes:

I don't think Scott is wrong to defend the phrase ISYFTW, but on a meta level, I think that the hyperstitious slur cascade is way past 70%. Of course it's hard to judge that in real time, but I think a good clue is the reaction of your community/tribe. The top comment on Substack is a video by a pretty popular comedian who says that everyone knows that ISYFTW means 'fuck you'. The top comments on the Subreddit do agree that the phrase is hostile.

So, while it may be logically okay to use the phrase, it might be time to retire it unless the message you intent to pass along is 'go fuck yourself'.

Yeah, I guess I agree with this. I was trying to defend it in a pretty limited sense:

• First, don’t necessarily pounce on / hate anybody who uses it in ignorance of the fact that the hyperstitious slur cascade has gotten that far.

• Second, we need to figure out some kind of alternative and coordinate to protect it from being slur-cascaded in turn.

• Third, we need it to be common knowledge not to cooperate in pushing the slur cascade even faster than it would already go.

…but maybe it’s a bit far to call that “defending” it.

Dave Madeley writes:

Saying "I'm sad for contradicting you" or "I don't enjoy disagreeing with you" owns the emotion without commenting on the other person's interior state, which often feels intrusive even if the intention is good (and oftentimes it isn't).

Many people had similarly good suggestions for alternative phrases.

Unfortunately, they remind me of the mid-2010s debate around “affirmative consent”. The idea was - sometimes women are uncomfortable with sex but too afraid to speak up, so men should directly ask “may I have sex with you?”. Or you could go even further - some women were comfortable with some sex acts but uncomfortable with others, so you should ask permission for each specific act: “May I put my penis in your vagina?”

This 100% solves the problem with no downsides - except that if any man actually did this, the woman would immediately suspect him of being a Martian spy. I’m not happy with the fact that this convenient solution wouldn’t work - just not deluded enough to deny it.

This is also how I feel about “I’m sad for contradicting you”. It sure does work in this situation. I just can’t imagine a real human saying it in a real situation. I think this is an illegible (and so underappreciated) cost. And the fact that “I’m sorry you feel that way” is one of the few phrases which is easy for a non-Martian to say is an illegible (and so underappreciated) benefit.

David Khoo writes:

You can apologize for the offense and hurt, without admitting that the other person is factually correct or that you agree with them. "I am sorry for offending you." "I apologize for making you feel hurt." If needed and appropriate, you can follow that with "...but I don't agree with you". Use your social judgement.

This solution makes me feel the way that the original phrase makes some of you feel.

It clearly crosses the gulf from “expression of sympathy” to “apology”. But it doesn’t really suggest you did anything wrong, or that you won’t do the same thing again.

Suppose you are a college speaker, advocating a political point which you believe to be true and important. Someone in the audience says they’re triggered by it and now you’ve traumatized them. You want to express sympathy. But you’re not going to stop going to colleges and speaking about this topic. Maybe you won’t even change the exact text of your speech.

I don’t want to get myself in a position where I sound like I’m apologizing for something, in words that sound like they’re admitting some sort of fault, and then the person says “Well, you’ve admitted you were in the wrong, what are you going to do to change things going forward?” and I have to say “Definitely nothing, ever.”

Peter writes:

I'm sorry, but sorry and sorrow are not related words and do not mean the same thing. Sorrow has to do with sadness, while sorry is an expression of regret. An expression of regret does not imply that I feel any guilt or shame or even that I wished I had done differently.

Ending on an etymological note - this is true! “Sorry” is not related to “sorrow”. According to Wiktionary, it is an old adjective form of “sore” (ie sore + y), and ultimately comes from an Old English word meaning “sad”.